We reach the last episode of the official "The Last of Us" podcast, this time animator Almudena Soria and composer Gustavo Santaolalla join the previous guests Neil Druckmann, Ashley Johnson and Troy Baker.
Troy points out that everything comes full circle, since you're not in control of Ellie and the last time you were controlling someone who wasn't Joel, it was Sarah.
Only games can make you feel as if you are the character, and Neil really enjoyed seeing how people reacted to the sudden character switch. Being in the skin of Ellie, meant the players would feel more empathy towards the character.
Next, he proceeds to point out that David is always honest with Ellie but she still gets the feeling that something is off. It's unlike Joel, who has done bad things, but she is drawn to him, unlike to David.
Spicer asks how difficulty it was to humanize a cannibal and Druckmann explains that it's not just the cannibalism, but David also feels attracted to Ellie, so there's this other aspect of him and when he wants something and can't get it, he freaks out. The whole section in the cabin where you have to fight beside him is meant to show that despite all the weird "vibes", maybe you as the player can trust him. He'll save Ellie multiple times and help you get through that section of the game.
To Troy, David and Joel are similar, mirror images of each other, since the latter is simply looking out for his people. The bad things he has done are not that different from what Joel did.
When Ashley first read the scenes in the David section, she found them amazing and couldn't wait to shoot it, given how intense and heavy it was. Rage is an emotion that she can easily access. Her anger comes from losing a loved one too soon, that built up a certain kind of rebellious feeling inside of her which she learned to appreciate.
According to Neil, The Last of Us is a game that plays with familiar tropes and subverts them, so while going back and forth with Joel and Ellie, one may feel as if he is gonna save her, but it was important for Ellie to save herself. Instead, Joel saves her emotionally, just as she's been doing to him throughout most of the game.
Ashley believes that Ellie needed to go through that to learn she could take care of herself, but she appreciates that Joel was there in the end, not to fight her battles for her, but to take care of her in the aftermath. And that moment they take care of each other once Ellie kills David is important to show how much these characters care about each other and that they're finally showing affection. The word "babygirl" coming out of Joel's lips reveals he actually sees her as his daughter now, not a replacement for Sarah.
Gustavo Santaolalla, composer for The Last of Us (as well as Part II) says that ever since Neil first contacted him, he wanted to be a part of the game. The feeling of melancholy, despair as well as the humanity behind it all made him fall in love for the project and those were the feelings that were translated into music.
He creates the songs without thinking about which character each of them will go to, but he can connect the instruments to them. He believes the ronroco, an argentinian instrument that resembles a banjo, has a sort of feminine quality while the six-string bass is more masculine, Ellie and Joel respectively. Then, the guitar connects both characters.
Gustavo, unlike most composers, treasures the things that sound "off", such as the amp, the sound of when you slide your finger on the guitar strings, mistakes, silence itself. It adds more to the music than it takes off.
He likes to think that once he's not longer in this world, people will hear his music and still remember the game and the connection they created with these characters.
Going back to the game, we now enter the final section and Troy Baker comments on how distant Ellie feels from Joel. She's barely listening to him, keeping her distance and when the player tries to boost her up, she doesn't show up, even if they have been doing this the whole game. She's emotionally distant.
The one who speaks of the iconic giraffe scene is the animator Almudena Soria, who worked mostly on Ellie, to her it was a surprise, since it's a scene without any combat or anything of the sort and she doesn't know why they picked giraffes, but she's glad they did because they're big majestic animals and anyone would be surprised by seeing them. She also enjoys how character-driven this game is and ever since then, she has been looking for other types of games that focus on the story.
Talking about the ending of the game, Troy instantly points out that the fact the Fireflies want to sacrifice Ellie releases the beast inside Joel.
According to Neil, Marlene also cares about Ellie and this is where she is similar to Joel. However, even if she promised Ellie's mom she would take care of her child, she accepts that she'll have to sacrifice her for the good of mankind.
In media, we often see these stories where the world is saved, but that doesn't feel real. It's much more honest to watch a parent saving their child. This game is about how we'll always choose to save the ones we love, instead of saving the world.
You can see both Joel and the Fireflies as the "bad guy" in the end. On one side, you have this man who chooses to save a little girl instead of humanity, but in the other, you have people willing to kill a child to possibly create a vaccine, but they're not even sure if they'd have succesful results. There's no right or wrong here and it's up to the player to choose where they stand.
Ashley understands Joel's choice and despite not having kids, she does have 7 nieces and nephews and she would surely kill everyone in the hospital for any of them, but she wouldn't lie. But she thinks Joel did it because he wouldn't be able to deal with Ellie being disappointed at him.
To Neil, Ellie finally got what she've always wanted: someone who won't leave, someone who'll love her inconditionally. So even if she doesn't trust his lie completely in the end, how will she reconcile both things?
To Joel, the ultimate sacrifice is that he's willing to risk his relationship with Ellie to save her. As long as she doesn't need to go back to that hospital and no one can hurt her, as long as she is alive, he can take it if she pulls away from him.
You can listen to the podcast here.
Stay tuned, next we're going to start talking about the second game! ;)
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